Billboard scans of Capitol-Emi/ Enigma JV and Enigma ending (proving DV made up his claims)

[Luxor]

I'm sure DoubleV will attack these Billboard articles as well. He's already attacked the LA Times writer of getting it wrong and he ignored the paraphrased stories from these I already posted.

Capitol DID NOT own Enigma like Double V claimed. Total BS!
Enigma was never in a position to release GFH like he claimed. More made up fiction!

Remember when Vinnie did the story for Kerrang about GFH? It wasn't long after that when word was going out Enigma was going under! That came out Dec 15, 1990 issue. The interview was probably done in October or so. Soon after, Enigma would be in complete flux. People jumping ship etc.

This is why it is so ridiculous for anyone to fall for the Robert Fleishman false claims of "Vinnie shopping the record" killed off the deal. Enigma was finished. And there were labels interested in picking it up (including Hollywood Records). But even if Enigma took .50 on the dollar that would still be hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Robert just makes stuff up depending on the time of the month it seems. I don't know how Vinnie can talk to him after all the stuff he has done and made up.


Also, I'm sure DoubleV will complain Billboard isn't a legitimate source! I mean, he posted stuff from Wikipedia.
Almost everything he has ever claimed hasn't been accurate.

Remember he even claimed Invasion videos didn't get played on MTV. Didn't matter the great rotation they got. He didn't even know what that meant. But remember, he "grew up in the industry" His postings sure show that to be in question.

I gotta thank my buddy for those scans.



The JV between Capitol-EMI and Enigma ending in Divorce

BILLBOARD 11/24/1990

Enigma Canada closing its doors 1/26/1991

Enigma Canada closes doors 1 26 1991.jpg (89.62 KiB) Viewed 18801 times

Billboard Feb 2, 1991

Enigma feb 2 1991.jpg (70.15 KiB) Viewed 18801 times

Massive Layoffs at Enigma. Only 15 out of 70 remain



Billboard April 19, 1991 Enigma is finished

April 19 1991 Enigma ends .jpg (48.39 KiB) Viewed 18801 times

Vinnie interview in Kerrang DEC 15, 1990 issue

[Luxor]

New Record Labels Defying Industry Trend : Music: While the bigger firms trim staffs and reorganize functions, small start-ups are having no trouble finding backers.
By JUBE SHIVER Jr
Dec. 11, 1990 12 AM PT

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm ... story.html


HIGHLIGHTS about Enigma

Meanwhile, Enigma Entertainment, an independent Los Angeles-based heavy metal and alternative label, has slashed its 140-person staff to about 20. It may shut down this month if it can’t find a distributor to replace CEMA, the distribution arm of Los Angeles-based Capitol-EMI Music Inc.


Joe Regis, chief operating officer of Enigma Entertainment, attributed Enigma’s problems to differences with its distributor but said the company also expanded too fast at a time when the economy was slowing. “When I joined the company (last spring), we were forced to begin immediately downsizing the company,” he said.

[doublev2]

Juliet release 1990/1991 enigma / capitol https://www.eonianrecords.com/blog/julliet-reissue

[doublev2]

"One year to the day after hitting L.A., Enigma/Capitol Records signed JULLIET to a major label deal, where they released their self-titled album."

[Luxor]

"One year to the day after hitting L.A., Enigma/Capitol Records signed JULLIET to a major label deal, where they released their self-titled album."

One has to enjoy and laugh at the creativity of their press release. The kid who wrote that probably wasn't even alive back then. And I'm sure this nothing bad did not sell anywhere near 300,000. They were probably lucky to actually sell 30K

Their release was on Enigma https://www.allmusic.com/album/release/ ... 0001324738

Those trade mags list various artists and odd Julliet isn't mentioned in them as the JV wound down and how little success the JV had.


and let me use some of your type of "links" instead of actual trade publications


Julliet

Formed by guitarist Jimmy DeLisi and bassist Ty Westerhoff, Julliet would add vocalist Kenny McGee and drummer Greg Pecka to round out their lineup. They would eventually sign to Enigma Records to release their debut album in 1990. The album received decent praise from listeners and critics alike. Changing trends in music would overshadow glam metal bands and it would be 12 years before their second album “Passion” was finally released which featured Quiet Riot’s Kevin DuBrow on backup vocals and Frankie Banali on drums.
https://xsrock.com/250-underrated-hard- ... s-and-90s/



And lets look at LastFM where the band edited their own bio years ago

https://www.last.fm/music/Julliet/+wiki
Julliet performed their unique brand of melodic hard rock to capacity crowds throughout the southern United States. Relocating to the rock capital of L.A. from Florida in early 1988, the band gained a strong and loyal following, selling out show after show, earning the reputation as a powerful live band. One year to the day after they left the sunshine state, Julliet signed their deal with Enigma Records.



But instead of this kind of stuff, I prefer to stick with legitimate publications who covered Enigma back in the day and quotes in those publications from the owner etc.

But everyone is free to believe what they want. Billboard/LA Times etc vs blog postings and stuff 30 years later.

[doublev2]

Luxor still believes Capitol didn't own Enigma... haha

[Luxor]

Luxor still believes Capitol didn't own Enigma... haha

Yes, I live in the land of reality.

And my reality is backed up in these Music Trade Publications.

You are free to believe whatever you want.

You have shared nothing that would dispute anything that I have posted and shared. Nothing at all from any legitimate source.

I don't know why you keep talking about this. You should have let it go many days ago. You keep digging a bigger hole for yourself. But that's all on you.

[doublev2]

When enigma was closed by Capitol they kept the more successful acts such as poison who were now switched over to Capitol

Open Up And Say ..Ahh!
Label: Capitol Records, Enigma (4)
Year: 1988
148 versions
Faor Flesh & Blood
Label: Capitol Records, Enigma Records (3)
Year: 1990
112 versions
Swallow This Live
S C
Label: Capitol Records
Year: 1991
59 versions
Swallow This Live (Cass)
Label: Capitol Records
Cat #: 50697-4
Year: 1991
Swallow This Live (Cass)
Label: Capitol Records
Cat #: TC-C4 98038
Year: 1991
swallow This Live (Cass, Album)
Label: Capitol Records
Cat #: TC-C4 98038
Year: 1991
50,006>85,00

[Luxor]

When enigma was closed by Capitol they kept the more successful acts such as poison who were now switched over to Capitol

Enigma was Not Closed by Capitol-EMI. They couldn't do that. They didn't own it. They had a 50% interest as part of a JV.


As the trade publications make clear. Sorry you can't understand that at all.

Maybe you should go read all those scans and newspaper reports.

[doublev2]

Enigma was formally acquired by Capitol/EMI in 1989. Some of its catalog and operations were merged into the still independent Restless Records in 1991. Enigma's Canadian division was closed in 1992 and was reorganized into FRE Records before shuttering in 1999, after which its back catalogs was sold to DROG Records.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wiki
Enigma Records - Wikipedia

[Luxor]

Enigma was formally acquired by Capitol/EMI in 1989. Some of its catalog and operations were merged into the still independent Restless Records in 1991. Enigma's Canadian division was closed in 1992 and was reorganized into FRE Records before shuttering in 1999, after which its back catalogs was sold to DROG Records.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wiki
Enigma Records - Wikipedia

Someone needs to go edit the joke site Wikipedia with the truth. That's not it.

Anyone who wants to know what really happened can read about it from the scans and actual news links above. Sadly, one person believes Wikipedia over Legitimate trade publications.

They don't even believe the direct quotes from the Capitol-EMI spox (above) or the owner of Enigma (above).

And Hein addressed above what would happen with Poison and The Smithereens.

But again, anyone is free to believe a site anyone can edit versus legitimate news sources from back in the day as it was happening.

[doublev2]

Unbelievable.

[doublev2]

Official Enigma linked in https://www.linkedin.com/company/enigma-records/

Enigma Records
Musicians • Torrance, CA . 131 followers
Follow
C
Visit
website
Home
About
Posts
Jobs
People
Overview
Enigma Records was a record company founded in 1982 and
operated independently until 1989 when it was acquired by
Capitol / EMI and operated as a division of Capitol until being
merged into its operations in 1991. Enigma artists included
Poison, Stryper, Smithereens, Flaming Lips, Al Stewart, Devo
and several others. The label also marketed artists througt
EMI America from 1994- 1995 and signings included the
Red Hot Chili Peppers. The label's first signing was Motley
Crue, prior to the Enigma name even being used, so their first
album was marketed under the band's own "Leathur Records.
Website
https://twitter.com/EnigmaRecords

[doublev2]

https://www.billboard.com/music/music-n ... s-1306989/

According to the band’s lawsuit, they signed a contract with Enigma Records in 1986, which later transferred control to Capitol Records.

A representative for Capitol and EMI did not immediately return a phone message seeking comment today.

Poison claims it tried to audit the band’s records kept by Capitol, but the firm didn’t fully cooperate.

[Luxor]

https://www.billboard.com/music/music-n ... s-1306989/

According to the band’s lawsuit, they signed a contract with Enigma Records in 1986, which later transferred control to Capitol Records.

A representative for Capitol and EMI did not immediately return a phone message seeking comment today.

Poison claims it tried to audit the band’s records kept by Capitol, but the firm didn’t fully cooperate.

Sorry, you missed this part above when it came to Poison! I at least applaud you on finally using a better source than Wikipedia.

But as you can see the aspect of Poison was already mentioned above in the articles about the dissolution of the "marriage" (aka JV between Capitol-EMI and Enigma

Poison.jpg (85.07 KiB) Viewed 18684 times

Have a great day!

[doublev2]

The band xyz were moved over from Enigma in 1990 to Capitol in 1991 too. Showing that capitol kept on bands after closing enigma https://www.discogs.com/release/11498436-XYZ-XYZ

https://www.discogs.com/release/8276463-XYZ-XYZ

[Luxor]

The band xyz were moved over from Enigma in 1990 to Capitol in 1991 too. Showing that capitol kept on bands after closing enigma https://www.discogs.com/release/11498436-XYZ-XYZ

https://www.discogs.com/release/8276463-XYZ-XYZ

Of course, you are again failing to act like that stuff isn't covered in the Billboard articles above. Maybe you should go re-read them.

and I thought you loved Wikipedia:

A tour of the US with Ted Nugent followed the success of their 1989 Enigma-released debut album, which includes one of their best-known songs "Inside Out", and they were signed by major label Capitol for their 1991 follow-up Hungry.[2] XYZ disbanded in 1992 but has reunited occasionally since the early 2000s.


Thanks again for sharing. Nobody said Capitol didn't get some of the bands after the end of the JOINT VENTURE. I really don't know what point you think you are making.

and Capitol didn't close Enigma. It wasn't theirs to close. As the articles above make clear.

[Luxor]

Billboard October 17, 1992

I hope everyone reads this from Billboard. Once again, proving my point.

That poor band a victim of the ending of the Capitol-EMI/ Enigma Joint Venture. They got hung out to dry as everything fell apart.

Billboard Oc 17 1992 - Copy.jpg (147.49 KiB) Viewed 18676 times

[doublev2]

Capitol bought Enigma in 1989 and closed them in 1991.
They had a joint venture before the sell out. Capitol was the distributor of enigma until Capitol bought them in 1989..so to understand that Capitol records owned enigma when they dropped vinnie. That's it. No other argument here . That's who owned enigma in 1990/1991.
Vinnie's contract and recording was owned by capitol records via there fully owned subsidiary enigma .

Clear as day. Over and.out

[doublev2]

And vv used Capitol's enigma to pay for recording that he tried unsuccessfully to shop around .
End of

[Luxor]

And vv used Capitol's enigma to pay for recording that he tried unsuccessfully to shop around .
End of

No, it was Enigma who signed Vinnie. It was not Capitol-EMI who did it. And as Enigma was imploding, Vinnie tried to shop the album.

[Luxor]

Capitol bought Enigma in 1989 and closed them in 1991.
They had a joint venture before the sell out. Capitol was the distributor of enigma until Capitol bought them in 1989..so to understand that Capitol records owned enigma when they dropped vinnie. That's it. No other argument here . That's who owned enigma in 1990/1991.
Vinnie's contract and recording was owned by capitol records via there fully owned subsidiary enigma .

Clear as day. Over and.out

Wow, you are sayin the complete opposite of what happened. And the evidence from the trades backs up what I said.

How do you claim Capitol fully owned Enigma when all the evidence proves otherwise?!

But if you want to believe an alternate reality that is completely at odds with what happened. You are free to do that.

The Billboard story about Aversion just sums it all up. But you wont respond to any actual Billboard story on the matter.

Have a great day!

[doublev2]

Insanity ... fully or oart owned make a difference? It's 100 percent fully owned but what difference does it make .

The reality is you can't take what robert said and have to make a fake narrative regarding what robert said

[Luxor]

Insanity ... fully or oart owned make a difference? It's 100 percent fully owned but what difference does it make .

The reality is you can't take what robert said and have to make a fake narrative regarding what robert said

You are now claiming Capitol owned 100% of Enigma in 1989? Of course, that is at complete odds with what it says in the trades and also what people from Capitol and Enigma said.

The reality is Robert was wrong (as he often is).

You've provided nothing of legitimacy to back up your false claim. I on the other hand have provided plenty to prove what happened.

You can believe what you want. But that won't change anything that really happened.

Have a great day!


And in case you had trouble reading it before, the stuff is underlined just for you.

[Luxor]

Insanity ... fully or oart owned make a difference? It's 100 percent fully owned but what difference does it make .

The reality is you can't take what robert said and have to make a fake narrative regarding what robert said

Just wanted you to again make the inaccurate claim they purchased 100%. Here's Billboard June 9, 1990

It is a big difference. They didn't have control. Enigma still had control. And they had a Joint-Venture. Like almost every article pointed out.

Its really amazing how some will keep posting things that fly in the face of all the evidence. But more power to ya!


And I loved you throwing the word INSANITY towards me.

But I won't hold that against you. Have a great day.

[doublev2]

Acquired fully in 1989 which is why Capitol could close it

https://tmbw.net/wiki/Restless

"Restless Records.
Currently a subsidiary of Rykodisc, Restless Records was started as the indie distribution arm of Enigma Records after obtaining a distribution deal with Capitol. Enigma was acquired by Capitol in 1989 and Restless was acquired in 2001 by Rykodisc which was, in turn, acquired by the Warner Music Group in 2006."

. These major labels bought smaller ones to consolidate them..take their roster then close the office down.
Enigma had money from captiol to put out poison flesh and blood in 1990. Your narrative Luxor that Enigma were not able to put the record out has slipped away . Capitol could have funded as they did via Enigma or moved vv over to Capitol offices

[doublev2]

https://www.facebook.com/groups/4109964 ... tid=SDPelY

Directly from the founfers of enigma fb
11:26
5G .all 88%
Greenworld Distribution / Enigma..
Enigma Records was initially distributed
through independent record distributors,
and beginning in 1986, arranged distibution
through Capitol/EMI, a major record
label. Capitol/EMI acquired Enigma from
the Heins in 1989 and soon merged its
operations into Capitol, moving some of
the artists to the various EMI labels.
Enigma Records had at one time or another
the following bands on its roster:
Poison (through a joint venture with
Capitol), Stryper, Berlin, Mötley Crüe, Red
Hot Chili Peppers (through a joint venture
with EMI America), Ratt, Great White, the
Jntouchables, TSOL, 45 Grave, Slayer
(through a joint venture with Metal Blade
Records), Agent Orange, the Dead Milkmen
Channel 3, ike Willis, and many other rock
and alternative acts.
Enigma also released film soundtracks
including The Terminator and River's Edge.
Enigma also released some Mute Records
titles in the United States.
At the time of the Capitol distributior
agreement in 1986, Enigma formed a
subsidiary label, Restless Records, to
remain with the indepenent distributors
to nurture acts not ready for major label
distribution. A subdivision, Restless Retro,
nherited Enigma's arrangement with
Mute Records. Restless Records is now a
subsidiary of Rykodisc. ...

[doublev2]

1986, arranged distibution
through Capitol/EMI, a major record
label. Capitol/EMI acquired Enigma from
the Heins in 1989 and soon merged its
operations into Capitol, moving some of
the artists to the various EMI labels.
Enigma Records had at one time or another
the following bands on its roster:
Poison (through a joint venture with
Capitol), Stryper, Berlin, Mötley Crüe, Red
Hot Chili Peppers (through a joint venture
with EMI America), Ratt, Great White, the
Jntouchables, TSOL, 45 Grave, Slayer
(through a joint venture with Metal Blade
Records), Agent Orange, the Dead Milkmen
Channel 3, ike Willis, and many other rock
and alternative acts.

[doublev2]

Heins didn't sell half .. they sold it all.

[Luxor]

Billboard June 3, 1989

Capitol buys 50% of Enigma

Captil Buys 50 Billboard 6 3 1989.jpg (69.07 KiB) Viewed 18621 times

Billboard 5/20/1989

Billboard 5 20 1989.jpg (125.9 KiB) Viewed 18621 times

This explains why some Enigma acts got moved over to Capitol in their Joint Venture.


I'm so glad I was provided with these scans. Otherwise some might believe Wikipedia and other less reliable sources.

[Luxor]

Heins didn't sell half .. they sold it all.

You really going to keep pushing that when all the evidence shows that not to be the case?


Funny you can never respond to Billboard and Heins and Capitols own statements.

[doublev2]

Look at the bio of this band . The cavedogs were on enigma then capitol absorbed their enigma contract into Capitol records...because they OWNED enigma .. that's not possible if they didn't.

https://music.apple.com/us/artist/the-c ... 1253742478

The Cavedogs
United States of America . 1990 . Rock
Then, Capitol Records, who had a
distribution agreement with Enigma,
absorbed the band's contract, and the
group now found itself with a major-
label deal. The group's second album
the Michael Beinhorn-produced Soul
Martini, found the band in
considerably more polished form,

[Luxor]

Look at the bio of this band . The cavedogs were on enigma then capitol absorbed their enigma contract into Capitol records...because they OWNED enigma .. that's not possible if they didn't.

https://music.apple.com/us/artist/the-c ... 1253742478

The Cavedogs
United States of America . 1990 . Rock
Then, Capitol Records, who had a
distribution agreement with Enigma,
absorbed the band's contract, and the
group now found itself with a major-
label deal. The group's second album
the Michael Beinhorn-produced Soul
Martini, found the band in
considerably more polished form,

REALITY

Captil Buys 50 Billboard 6 3 1989.jpg (69.07 KiB) Viewed 18614 times

[doublev2]

You can't face upto capitol records didn't want vinnie and they pulled the plug because vv was shipping the recording they paid for around.

They would have wanted their money back from recoding so it's very likely after they pulled the plug on vinnie they would have wanted to sell those recordings so not to loose their investment. God only knows what else vinnie did at the time

[doublev2]

You going on an article by a journalist over the founder of.company. the company that bought it and the bands on the label ? Also what year was thst article ?
You have no idea how many mistakes journalists make .. its.100 percent beyond a doubt capitol owned enigma and dropped vinnie. Your arguments don't even help because even if half like you wrongly want to believe Capitol still dropped vinnie as half owner and could have easily absorbed the contract.

[Luxor]

You can't face upto capitol records didn't want vinnie and they pulled the plug because vv was shipping the recording they paid for around.

They would have wanted their money back from recoding so it's very likely after they pulled the plug on vinnie they would have wanted to sell those recordings so not to loose their investment. God only knows what else vinnie did at the time

They couldn't pull the plug. Enigma owned the contract. Capitol-EMI did not control Enigma with the 50% interest they purchased in 1989.

and when they "divorced" in 1991, Capitol-EMI still ownly owned 50% at the end.

As all the evidence shows.

Enigma paid for GFH.

Vinnie shopping it around was the best thing for Enigma, as they were out of money and going nowhere. As the Billboard articles clearly make clear.

And Hollywood Records was certainly interested until they found out how much was spent on the album.

Robert was wrong as all the evidence makes clear.

I will accept your apology anytime. Some know the music business. Others don't. That is clear.

[Luxor]

You going on an article by a journalist over the founder of.company. the company that bought it and the bands on the label ? Also what year was thst article ?
You have no idea how many mistakes journalists make .. its.100 percent beyond a doubt capitol owned enigma and dropped vinnie. Your arguments don't even help because even if half like you wrongly want to believe Capitol still dropped vinnie as half owner and could have easily absorbed the contract.

So when Capitol and Enigma's label were on record with the journalist, you want to now claim the journalists got all those stories wrong.

and I posted the billboard date about it the first time I posted that scan. How did you miss it?
Billboard June 3, 1989 Capitol buys 50% of Enigma


And you want everyone to believe, the LA Times etc got all those articles wrong.

And nobody was threatening to sue them over false information. And they kept going back for interviews with those publications because those authors got it wrong?

Is that what you seriously want everyone to believe because YOU GOT IT WRONG?!

You've been wrong this whole time. But you can't admit it. But that's cool.

Everyone is seeing you now acting like the journalists constantly got it wrong. They were wrong. Not you! Not a great look for you!

But have a great day!

[doublev2]

https://hitsdailydouble.com/news&id=278 ... N-HIS-MIND

"Hein formed Greenworld Record Distribution as an importer and independent distributor focused on heavy metal and punk in 1978. Greenworld later signed Mötley Crüe and in 1982, Hein created Enigma as a record label subsidiary of the company. In 1984, Hein led a buyout of Enigma and continued to operate it as one of the most successful independent record companies in the ‘80s, signing such gold and platinum selling acts as The Flaming Lips, Berlin, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Ratt, Stryper, the Smithereens, Poison and They Might Be Giants. In 1991, Hein oversaw the sale of Enigma to Capitol Records-EMI Music."

[Luxor]

https://hitsdailydouble.com/news&id=278 ... N-HIS-MIND

"Hein formed Greenworld Record Distribution as an importer and independent distributor focused on heavy metal and punk in 1978. Greenworld later signed Mötley Crüe and in 1982, Hein created Enigma as a record label subsidiary of the company. In 1984, Hein led a buyout of Enigma and continued to operate it as one of the most successful independent record companies in the ‘80s, signing such gold and platinum selling acts as The Flaming Lips, Berlin, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Ratt, Stryper, the Smithereens, Poison and They Might Be Giants. In 1991, Hein oversaw the sale of Enigma to Capitol Records-EMI Music."

I really don't know what you think you are supposed to prove by posting things 40 years after the fact.

You talked about journalists getting it wrong. What you posted is a great example of that. Nobody cares about the accuracy now.

But if you don't think Billboard, the LA Times etc wouldn't have been sued for posting such gross misinformation about a Public Company. But then I wouldn't expect you to know about that stuff either. One would need a business background to know things like that perhaps.

and then Billboard keeping posting the same 50% etc in all those other stories. But sure, lets claim the journalists constantly got it wrong and nobody at Capitol-EMI/Enigma cared Sure!

I mean, why accept reality when you can attack the journalists who wrote the stories. Nothing at all to back up your "claim". You would have saved everyone a ton of time if you just admitted you were wrong and sorry.

But again, you believe what you want to believe. Everyone else can see for their own eyes what is the truth

[doublev2]

Ultimately the record was a victim of grunge Rock whatever the story is with the labels..

[doublev2]

Spent way too much time on this haha.

[doublev2]

Luxor you still standing by the opening statement here .. you said i lied and Capitol didn't own Enigma.. you still saying that?

Yes everyone jumping ship with heavy metal at that time.

Where is link that Hollywood Records interested in picking it up?

I'm sure DoubleV will attack these Billboard articles as well. He's already attacked the LA Times writer of getting it wrong and he ignored the paraphrased stories from these I already posted.

Capitol DID NOT own Enigma like Double V claimed. Total BS!
Enigma was never in a position to release GFH like he claimed. More made up fiction!

Remember when Vinnie did the story for Kerrang about GFH? It wasn't long after that when word was going out Enigma was going under! That came out Dec 15, 1990 issue. The interview was probably done in October or so. Soon after, Enigma would be in complete flux. People jumping ship etc.

This is why it is so ridiculous for anyone to fall for the Robert Fleishman false claims of "Vinnie shopping the record" killed off the deal. Enigma was finished. And there were labels interested in picking it up (including Hollywood Records). But even if Enigma took .50 on the dollar that would still be hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Robert just makes stuff up depending on the time of the month it seems. I don't know how Vinnie can talk to him after all the stuff he has done and made up.


Also, I'm sure DoubleV will complain Billboard isn't a legitimate source! I mean, he posted stuff from Wikipedia.
Almost everything he has ever claimed hasn't been accurate.

Remember he even claimed Invasion videos didn't get played on MTV. Didn't matter the great rotation they got. He didn't even know what that meant. But remember, he "grew up in the industry" His postings sure show that to be in question.

I gotta thank my buddy for those scans.



The JV between Capitol-EMI and Enigma ending in Divorce

BILLBOARD 11/24/1990
Enigma 001.jpg

enigma 11 24 1990.jpg



Enigma Canada closing its doors 1/26/1991
Enigma Canada closes doors 1 26 1991.jpg



Billboard Feb 2, 1991
Enigma feb 2 1991.jpg
Massive Layoffs at Enigma. Only 15 out of 70 remain



Billboard April 19, 1991 Enigma is finished
April 19 1991 Enigma ends .jpg




Vinnie interview in Kerrang DEC 15, 1990 issue

Kerrang V cover.jpg


V Kerr.jpg

quote=Luxor post_id=133696 time=1687550443 user_id=1909]
I'm sure DoubleV will attack these Billboard articles as well. He's already attacked the LA Times writer of getting it wrong and he ignored the paraphrased stories from these I already posted.

Capitol DID NOT own Enigma like Double V claimed. Total BS!
Enigma was never in a position to release GFH like he claimed. More made up fiction!

Remember when Vinnie did the story for Kerrang about GFH? It wasn't long after that when word was going out Enigma was going under! That came out Dec 15, 1990 issue. The interview was probably done in October or so. Soon after, Enigma would be in complete flux. People jumping ship etc.

This is why it is so ridiculous for anyone to fall for the Robert Fleishman false claims of "Vinnie shopping the record" killed off the deal. Enigma was finished. And there were labels interested in picking it up (including Hollywood Records). But even if Enigma took .50 on the dollar that would still be hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Robert just makes stuff up depending on the time of the month it seems. I don't know how Vinnie can talk to him after all the stuff he has done and made up.


Also, I'm sure DoubleV will complain Billboard isn't a legitimate source! I mean, he posted stuff from Wikipedia.
Almost everything he has ever claimed hasn't been accurate.

Remember he even claimed Invasion videos didn't get played on MTV. Didn't matter the great rotation they got. He didn't even know what that meant. But remember, he "grew up in the industry" His postings sure show that to be in question.

I gotta thank my buddy for those scans.



The JV between Capitol-EMI and Enigma ending in Divorce

BILLBOARD 11/24/1990
Enigma 001.jpg

enigma 11 24 1990.jpg



Enigma Canada closing its doors 1/26/1991
Enigma Canada closes doors 1 26 1991.jpg



Billboard Feb 2, 1991
Enigma feb 2 1991.jpg
Massive Layoffs at Enigma. Only 15 out of 70 remain



Billboard April 19, 1991 Enigma is finished
April 19 1991 Enigma ends .jpg




Vinnie interview in Kerrang DEC 15, 1990 issue

Kerrang V cover.jpg


V Kerr.jpg
[/quote]

[Luxor]

Ultimately the record was a victim of grunge Rock whatever the story is with the labels..

Since the JV was being dissolved starting around Oct/November of 1990, you think that was the trouble??


Lets look at what MTV was playing in November of 1990. Does someone need to explain what the Rotation on these charts are? Remember what you said about that.

So bands like Bon Jovi, AC/DC, Nelson, Scorpions, Winger, Motley Crue, Poison, Heart, Judas Priest, Styx, Dann Yankees, Cheap Trick, Trixster, Poison, Alias, House of Lords etc.

Yeah, it sure looked like grunge was dominate in November 1990 as the JV between Capitol-EMI and Enigma was falling apart and on the way to divorce. Sure

But then I guess one might have had to work in the industry or know their music history to know Grunge wasn't the thing then.

MTV 2 1990.jpg (59.03 KiB) Viewed 18582 times

Have a wonderful day!

[Luxor]

Luxor you still standing by the opening statement here .. you said i lied and Capitol didn't own Enigma.. you still saying that?

Yes everyone jumping ship with heavy metal at that time.

Where is link that Hollywood Records interested in picking it up?

You said Capitol owned 100% of Enigma. I put in numerous headlines on the main page Capitol-EMI bought 50% of the company. They didn't own it. They didn't control it. They had a JV with Enigma. As I said countless times. And as you DENIED countless times!

How many times did you post saying that wasn't the case?

But I do think its funny you are trying to now "move the goal posts" because even you can't spin it anymore that Capitol bought 100% of Enigma and they controlled it.

And as the MTV playlist shows from Nov 1990, people weren't jumping from heavy metal music.

I don't know how many times I person could be so wrong. I have yet to see an apology from you. But that's ok because I didn't think you would apologize.






doublev2 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 9:17 pm
Enigma were in position to release...why would they put out an album that they paid for and the artist used the recording to try and get a better deal? On top of that 1990 this music was so out of date for the target teenage audience .

Enigma owned by capital records at time with huge resources..the issue is vinnie. The material was highly uncommercial and grunge Rock had taken over . It's nothing short of a miracle Slaughter went double platinum in 1990.



Enigma was in NO POSITION to release Vinnie's album as the JV was falling apart in November 1990 FACT

That music was NOT OUT OF DATE in 1990 as the MTV playlist from November of 1990 clearly shows FACT

Enigma was not owned by Capitol Records at the time. They owned 50% but they didn't control things. They had a JV. FACT
and the fact that they owned 50% is immaterial as you "Claimed" Capitol owned 100% of Enigma starting in 1989. COMPLETELY FALSE


Grunge Rock HAD NOT taken over Fact

Actually Slaughter 2x Multi-Platinum | May 10, 1991
and since then the album has sold another 1M+ copies in the US (not certified). So I think you got yet another one WRONG Fact

[doublev2]

Enigma was 100 percent sold not 50 percent but who cares. I love the way you get everything wrong haha

Luxor you still standing by the opening statement here .. you said i lied and Capitol didn't own Enigma.. you still saying that?

Yes everyone jumping ship with heavy metal at that time.

Where is link that Hollywood Records interested in picking it up?

You said Capitol owned 100% of Enigma. I put in numerous headlines on the main page Capitol-EMI bought 50% of the company. They didn't own it. They didn't control it. They had a JV with Enigma. As I said countless times. And as you DENIED countless times!

How many times did you post saying that wasn't the case?

But I do think its funny you are trying to now "move the goal posts" because even you can't spin it anymore that Capitol bought 100% of Enigma and they controlled it.

And as the MTV playlist shows from Nov 1990, people weren't jumping from heavy metal music.

I don't know how many times I person could be so wrong. I have yet to see an apology from you. But that's ok because I didn't think you would apologize.






doublev2 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 9:17 pm
Enigma were in position to release...why would they put out an album that they paid for and the artist used the recording to try and get a better deal? On top of that 1990 this music was so out of date for the target teenage audience .

Enigma owned by capital records at time with huge resources..the issue is vinnie. The material was highly uncommercial and grunge Rock had taken over . It's nothing short of a miracle Slaughter went double platinum in 1990.



Enigma was in NO POSITION to release Vinnie's album as the JV was falling apart in November 1990 FACT

That music was NOT OUT OF DATE in 1990 as the MTV playlist from November of 1990 clearly shows FACT

Enigma was not owned by Capitol Records at the time. They owned 50% but they didn't control things. They had a JV. FACT
and the fact that they owned 50% is immaterial as you "Claimed" Capitol owned 100% of Enigma starting in 1989. COMPLETELY FALSE


Grunge Rock HAD NOT taken over Fact

Actually Slaughter 2x Multi-Platinum | May 10, 1991
and since then the album has sold another 1M+ copies in the US (not certified). So I think you got yet another one WRONG Fact

[Luxor]

Luxor you still standing by the opening statement here .. you said i lied and Capitol didn't own Enigma.. you still saying that?

Yes everyone jumping ship with heavy metal at that time.

Where is link that Hollywood Records interested in picking it up?

You said Capitol owned 100% of Enigma. I put in numerous headlines on the main page Capitol-EMI bought 50% of the company. They didn't own it. They didn't control it. They had a JV with Enigma. As I said countless times. And as you DENIED countless times!

How many times did you post saying that wasn't the case?

But I do think its funny you are trying to now "move the goal posts" because even you can't spin it anymore that Capitol bought 100% of Enigma and they controlled it.

And as the MTV playlist shows from Nov 1990, people weren't jumping from heavy metal music.

I don't know how many times I person could be so wrong. I have yet to see an apology from you. But that's ok because I didn't think you would apologize.






doublev2 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 9:17 pm
Enigma were in position to release...why would they put out an album that they paid for and the artist used the recording to try and get a better deal? On top of that 1990 this music was so out of date for the target teenage audience .

Enigma owned by capital records at time with huge resources..the issue is vinnie. The material was highly uncommercial and grunge Rock had taken over . It's nothing short of a miracle Slaughter went double platinum in 1990.



Enigma was in NO POSITION to release Vinnie's album as the JV was falling apart in November 1990 FACT

That music was NOT OUT OF DATE in 1990 as the MTV playlist from November of 1990 clearly shows FACT

Enigma was not owned by Capitol Records at the time. They owned 50% but they didn't control things. They had a JV. FACT
and the fact that they owned 50% is immaterial as you "Claimed" Capitol owned 100% of Enigma starting in 1989. COMPLETELY FALSE


Grunge Rock HAD NOT taken over Fact

Actually Slaughter 2x Multi-Platinum | May 10, 1991
and since then the album has sold another 1M+ copies in the US (not certified). So I think you got yet another one WRONG Fact

Enigma was 100 percent sold not 50 percent but who cares. I love the way you get everything wrong haha

The facts and proof are all there for everyone to see.

But thank you for showing everyone your true self. I'm thankful for that. Now everyone can see how you are ...

but as I keep saying, you are free to believe Wikipedia and other fake stuff. You even attacked journalists.

Even though numerous journalists, the owner of Enigma you name it all said the same thing in articles above from 1989, 1990, 1991 and even 1992.

But some bloggers and wikpedia allegedly got it right all these years later. Sure

[doublev2]

So LinkedIn enigma has it right

https://www.linkedin.com/company/enigma-records/

From LinkedIn overview .

"
Enigma Records
Musicians . Torrance, CA . 131 followers
+Follow
Visit
website
Home
About
Posts
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People
Overview
Enigma Records was a record company founded in 1982 and
operated independently until 1989 when it was acquired by
Capitol / EMI and operated as a division of Capitol until being
merged into its operations in 1991. Enigma artists included
Poison, Stryper, Smithereens, Flaming Lips, Al Stewart, Devo
and several others. The label also marketed artists througl
EMI America from 1994- 1995 and signings included the
Red Hot Chili Peppers. The label's first signing was Motley
Crue, prior to the Enigma name even being used, so their first
album was marketed under the band's own "Leathur Records.
Website
https://twitter.com/EnigmaRecords

"

[pullitt]

No audio here.

[n3p]

Get a room you two