I am intrigued by Jungian psychology. Recently, I was discussing a James Hetfield debate often on personality type forums with a friend.

Is James Hetfield an INFJ or an INTJ? The answer to this question could explain James strained relationship with religion, and Metallica's musical direction when he takes the reigns.

James Hetfield is an INTJ.

There are two natural characteristics to an INTJ's face: 1) a poker face, and 2) an intense "hawkish" look often mistaken for anger. People will ask an INTJ, "what's wrong?" thinking an INTJ is mad. Also, INTJs are tough-minded. This is the personality function at work. INTJs are determined to survive the pain.

An INTJ is a strategist. An INTJ is an effective manager/director when (s)he takes the reigns. INTJs tend to want to avoid power struggles. Harmony and reliability is important to the INTJ. An INTJ doesn't like losing loved ones, and are devoted to keeping them. INTJs are very loyal. Like INFJs, INTJs prefer close friendships to popularity.

"INTJs are strong individualists who seek new angles or novel ways of looking at things. They enjoy coming to new understandings. They tend to be insightful and mentally quick; however, this mental quickness may not always be outwardly apparent to others since they keep a great deal to themselves. They are very determined people who trust their vision of the possibilities, regardless of what others think. They may even be considered the most independent of all of the sixteen personality types. INTJs are at their best in quietly and firmly developing their ideas, theories, and principles."
—Sandra Krebs Hirsc

INTJs often struggle with religious faith from an early age. This often places the INTJ at odds with a religious parent. INTJs desire honest relationships. This is consistent reasoning with trust. INTJs just cannot win against religion or rituals.

INTJs and INFJs are often confused. INTJs see the big picture of reasoning, and INFJs see the emotional big picture. Two different insights. INFJs are an enigma, INTJs are emotionally hard to read. INFJs are sensitive, INTJs are tough.

Geoff Tate is an INFJ
James Hetfield is an INTJ

Caregivers (INFJ) are the rarest personality type
Strategists (INTJ) are the second rarest personality type

Not much is widely known about either

I know I'm a GIT!!!!!!

Heavy stuff KMA.

Hmmmm, let me get kinda deep here... seeing all the bullshit Vinnie has pulled and I still remain a fan, I guess my personality type is an IVVF (Idiotic Vinnie Vincent Fan).

PinkWiz wrote:Hmmmm, let me get kinda deep here... seeing all the bullshit Vinnie has pulled and I still remain a fan, I guess my personality type is an IVVF (Idiotic Vinnie Vincent Fan).

Yep, I'm an IVVF too !!!

James Hetfield is a confused human being like the rest of us.

PinkWiz wrote:Hmmmm, let me get kinda deep here... seeing all the bullshit Vinnie has pulled and I still remain a fan, I guess my personality type is an IVVF (Idiotic Vinnie Vincent Fan).

Actually, a weakness of Vinnie's personality type is perceiving oneself as the victim, mistaking constructive criticism with meaness, and shutting other people out to avoid getting hurt. With Vinnie's personality, it's all about staying positive....

Too bad he doesn't know that.

And Bingo was his name-o!!!!!

poserboy71 wrote:

PinkWiz wrote:Hmmmm, let me get kinda deep here... seeing all the bullshit Vinnie has pulled and I still remain a fan, I guess my personality type is an IVVF (Idiotic Vinnie Vincent Fan).

Yep, I'm an IVVF too !!!

James Hetfield is a confused human being like the rest of us.

INTJ Children: Strengths and Weaknesses

Potential Strengths
• They’re usually very intelligent
• They can grasp the big picture easily
• They can see any far-reaching consequences of their actions
• They’re very resourceful
• They are extremely creative and imaginative
• They easily come up with good ideas
• They’re usually well-liked by their peers
• They will completely master a subject that interests them
• Their desire to be in control of themselves makes them take responsibility for their actions
• They are usually confident in their ideas, and know instinctively when they are right about something


Potential Weaknesses
• They have short attention spans
• They get bored easily with details or routine tasks
• They won’t put any effort into doing something that doesn’t interest them
• They frequently don’t hear people
• Once they have made up their mind about something, they can be very stubborn about it
• They ignore details
• They are unsettled by change, and don’t usually adapt well to new situations
• They’re uncomfortable and somewhat overwhelmed by large groups
• They are rather unaware of their environment, and seem “out of it”
• They are rather self-centered, and may be unaware of how their actions or words affect others
• They can be controlling and bossy
• Although they come up with ideas easily, they don’t do as well implementing their ideas

What about INFJs? I have quite a fondness for them, especially their eyes....Actually...their weaknesses are insignificant. If only there were more


Back to INTJ weaknesses. They forgot sarcasm, insensitivity, derisiveness, and hypersensitivity to potential abandonment. Distrust should be added to the list too.

Very interesting read. I read CS Hyatt's 'Psychopaths Bible' awhile ago. There's a link for any one who wants to read it. http://www.scribd.com/doc/3183248/CS-Hy ... aths-Bible

metatron wrote:Very interesting read. I read CS Hyatt's 'Psychopaths Bible' awhile ago. There's a link for any one who wants to read it. http://www.scribd.com/doc/3183248/CS-Hy ... aths-Bible

Thank you. I'm an INTJ. I needed a good cry today.

Do you think Ted Bundy would post his strengths and weaknesses? If he were alive today, he'd tell you he doesn't have any weaknesses. He couldn't even acknowledge them. I did.

Fuck psychopaths. I have seen monkeys kill one another on the Discovery channel. It's from the same mentality as throwing feces. Fuck any idiot that thinks tormenting kittens is fun. Fuck anyone who has signed a declaration of war, too. They are murderers too. Anyone with the mentality of primative ancestors that pick fleas off each other, is an evolutionary throwback. Truth. George W. Bush is a big gorilla that belongs in the same cage with Charles Manson. Screw them all. The cro magnons are extinct and this species is pointing nukes at one another, engineering octuplets, and breeding communist slaves in China and India.

Murder, rape, kidnapping, stealing, lynching, and war are low standards for humanity. The lowest. I feel disgust for Harry Truman after seeing the mutated children born dead as a result of his teaching Japan a lesson. He poisoned his own world, not to mention all the innocent people caught in the radiation. Ted Bundy, Jim Jones, Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Truman, Ted Bundy.....Unevolved brains can't wait to destroy their own species to feel some power.

How can they even compare people who think different to psychopaths? Inventors think different, heck even artists think different from the norm. Rare personality types just happen to think outside the norm and many are creative. Thinking in the norm would technically be left brain. Many members her actually think outside the norm, or right brained. Left brain dominance is the most common thinking type. That book is insulting to alot of different thinking types that don't fit inside the box.INTPs, or the scientific type don't conform to social rituals either. Without INTPs there'd be no computers. No medical technology that saves lives.

More heavy stuff KMA, I agree with you on the mentality of the war mongers.

What type is Mr Cusano?

Totally agree with you KMA. But unfortunately we live a world that is controlled by the Psychopaths. They hold the power. And the only reason they are in Power is because the mega Psychopaths want them there & have the power to brainwash the masses to believing that they are doing the right thing by the people they are meant to represent. Just look at the Global Financial Crises. This is no accident. This was totally pre planed. I just have to look this week that an Australian Airline called Qantas & how their Board of Directors & CEO purposely want to destroy the Company so as to not pay their employees any retirement & retrechment benefits. Then have already started a new company with different award structures so as to pay the works less. Qantas make million of dollars in profit every year, but still aren't happy. Why, aren't they happy you ask. Yer sure they got their 5 million dollar salaries, but they don't have the power. They want the power. The power to enslave you & I, body & mind. This is example is not out of the norm. This is the norm.

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Zzzzzzzztttttt! Not great what the Qantas board has done BUT Qantas employees are paid 15-20% more than employees of other airlines already and the unions were asking for even more money. This in a time after the GFC where airlines are suffering. Great gig being a Qantas baggage handler if you can get it. Didn't look great with the execs pay rise I'll admit. But a couple of million is peanuts compared to what they would have had to pay if the unions got their way. They would bleed Qantas dry!

Subprime mess goes back to the Carter days, that's how deep that runs. GW Bush(!!!!!) actually looked into banking regulations but was blocked by the democrats who controlled the Senate.
I don't care which way anyone leans voting wise but Barney Frank is a lying scumbag who continued to talk up Fanny and Freddy while they were being buried in bad lending.

The Weekend Australian had an excerpt from a new book, Boomerrang, The Meltdown Tour by Michael Lewis that really gets into the Greeks! Basically stating that the tax system was so lax that nearly everyone cheated on their taxes!!! And they lied to get into the Eurozone. Goldman Sachs helped them write up their shoddy financial figures………… hmmmmmmm maybe you're onto something Dannii???

Sorry, but I disagree with Qantas employees are paid '15-20% more than employees of other airlines'. That's probably the truth, but we in Australia don't live in a 3rd world statues. We live in a place where you can't by a house for under half a mill. (And not a good house...basically a shit hole for half a mill) . We live with Globalism...Mercantilism.
And it just doesn't work unless you want to deliberately devalue the standard of living of a country like Australia down to a 3rd world status. It's isn't an even playing field.
I grew up were the fruit, milk, soft drinks, newspapers, bread, meat & Doctors (yes Doctors) would come to your house. There was no internet. No mobile phones & the shops would close at midday on Saturday & not open till Monday morning. No one was freaking out that they weren't going to get food on the table. I was able to pay a house ($180,000) off at 18% interest in the 80's in less that 7 years. Good luck to the current generation in doing that. My parents paid their house off in 5 years with only my Father working one job. Now with another bullshit tax 'Carbon tax' (yer that thing that makes plants & vegetation flourish) on it's way in, we'll totally be in state of bondage. Enjoy the NWO.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercantilism

Ernest Hemingway once wrote, 'The world is a fine place and worth the fighting for'
In it's current state (the world) I agree with the second part of that statement

Yes, But does James Hetfield like mustard or mayonnaise on his sandwich ???
What was the initial question again ???

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metatron wrote:[youtube][/youtube]

That's why I don't even try to figure things out. I'll stick to being a walking DICK JOKE !!!

poserboy71 wrote:
That's why I don't even try to figure things out. I'll stick to being a walking DICK JOKE !!!

Don't know about that Rick...VV would think otherwise of you.

I just wanna sit at his dinner table with him , crack some fart jokes, and maybe he'll give me some advice on how to be insensitive.

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Wow! Your wang can walk!!!!! That's incredible!!!!!

It also spits, turns red when it's angry, and plays a mean game of hide and seek !!!

Genebaby wrote:More heavy stuff KMA, I agree with you on the mentality of the war mongers.

What type is Mr Cusano?

Awesome question.

My guess is ISFP. The Artist/Composer.

Weaknesses are often a difficult subject for ISFPs, because they "wear their hearts on their sleeves". ISFPs take criticism to heart, when it usually meant to improve someone's life. This in itself is a struggle for sensitive Feeling personalities, considering criticism is more painful for them. Their guage of others intentions is easily influenced by their own sensitivity.

Some characteristics, I have recognized in Vinnie's relationship with money. He spends, tries to make money through business but does not have the planning or preparation. He is better at spontaneity. Playing his guitar, and not even concerning himself with the business end.

Also, the "need to be well-represented" weakness seems to fit him to tee. When he is not "well-represented" it's disasterous. Difficulty grasping the law, this maybe an explanation for the KISS suits. I'm not terribly fond of Gene's greed, but the court only recognizes his legal rights to the copyrights.

ISFP General Description

- Most misunderstood of all.
- Tendency not to express themselves directly, but through action.
- Does not plan and prepare.
- Special kind of intelligence.
- Kindest of all the types.
- Sometimes seen by others as reserved and private.
- Instinctive longing for the natural, the pastoral, the bucolic.
- Easily bored, wanting excitement, risk, chance and tests of luck.
- Spender rather than a saver.
- Likely to become a pacifist or environmentalist.
- Negotiates with ease.
- As negotiator, goes into a situation with the intent of getting warring factions to compromise.
- Troubleshooting
- Very low need to lead and control others.
- Lives harmoniously.
- Encourages all life to fulfill its potential.
- Difficult for ISFPs to understand the need of some people to impose limits or structure on others.
- Blends in.
- Can easily be overlooked or overpowered .
- Creative, artsy.
- Often oblivious to the "standard" way.
- Little need to lead or influence.
- Little interest in the conceptual and abstract and is most responsive to the pragmatic.
- Money is secondary, the primary concern is that service be rendered .
- Little need to plan.




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Negotiator
ISFPs as Negotiators

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Strengths
Strengths of ISFPs

Bring personal values to negotiating.
Will protect personal values.
Until ideals are compromised, can be flexible, adaptable in negotiations.
Very compassionate towards those who are needy.
Can be effective conciliators.
Will consider options/possibilities.
Will handle difficulties in negotiations easily.




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Weaknesses
Weaknesses of ISFPs as Negotiators

Under stress may be critical, disparaging, disgusted with other's "stupid" ideas.
Not good negotiators.
Gentle, retiring nature makes them ineffective except in a well-structured environment.
Needs to be well-represented.
Because of idealism and loyalty, ISFPs will suffer considerably from separation distress.
Needs to wait until fully disengaged to negotiate.
Goals "too perfect" to be readily achievable if the spouse is strong-willed.
Their retiring nature may require third party intervention.
Will put off coming to the table until late in process due to desire to put things off.
Finds it difficult to express opinions strongly.




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How this temperament see themselves as Negotiators
How the ISFP sees Self

Very affirming.
Sympathetic and trusting.
Good communicator especially where values and ideals are involved.
Hard working and practical.




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How others see this temperament as negotiators
How Others see the ISFP

Difficult to negotiate with.
Won't follow divorce laws or is naive about what actual law is.
Not serious enough about negotiations.
Flaky and irresponsible.

poserboy71 wrote:Yes, But does James Hetfield like mustard or mayonnaise on his sandwich ???
What was the initial question again ???

The question basically asks whether James function is the director or Metallica or Lars' counselor.

People who think he's the best manager of Metallica's musical direction go with INTJ

People who thinks he's the best therapist for Lars Ulrich go with INFJ.

Well since watching the "Some Kind Of Monster" DVD, I can see that James no longer needs to impose himself on others. He almost lost EVERYTHING because of this need. It hit home when I believe his wife threatened to leave. Seriously, Who goes on a hunting trip on your child's birthday ???
James actually gained more control by giving up some control to the other members.

I will say that James is an INTJ simply because HE is Metallica's musical director. Without him, NO METALLICA.

You will notice that it's USUALLY the least talented that have the biggest mouths.( Lars and myself) I wouldn't tolerate anyone yelling in my face like Lars did to James,yet, James took it like he felt he deserved it.

shramiac wrote:Zzzzzzzztttttt! Not great what the Qantas board has done BUT Qantas employees are paid 15-20% more than employees of other airlines already and the unions were asking for even more money. This in a time after the GFC where airlines are suffering. Great gig being a Qantas baggage handler if you can get it. Didn't look great with the execs pay rise I'll admit. But a couple of million is peanuts compared to what they would have had to pay if the unions got their way. They would bleed Qantas dry!

Subprime mess goes back to the Carter days, that's how deep that runs. GW Bush(!!!!!) actually looked into banking regulations but was blocked by the democrats who controlled the Senate.
I don't care which way anyone leans voting wise but Barney Frank is a lying scumbag who continued to talk up Fanny and Freddy while they were being buried in bad lending.

The Weekend Australian had an excerpt from a new book, Boomerrang, The Meltdown Tour by Michael Lewis that really gets into the Greeks! Basically stating that the tax system was so lax that nearly everyone cheated on their taxes!!! And they lied to get into the Eurozone. Goldman Sachs helped them write up their shoddy financial figures………… hmmmmmmm maybe you're onto something Dannii???

Subprime mess goes back to the Carter days, that's how deep that runs. GW Bush(!!!!!) actually looked into banking regulations but was blocked by the democrats who controlled the Senate.
I don't care which way anyone leans voting wise but Barney Frank is a lying scumbag who continued to talk up Fanny and Freddy while they were being buried in bad lending.

The Weekend Australian had an excerpt from a new book, Boomerrang, The Meltdown Tour by Michael Lewis that really gets into the Greeks! Basically stating that the tax system was so lax that nearly everyone cheated on their taxes!!! And they lied to get into the Eurozone. Goldman Sachs helped them write up their shoddy financial figures………… hmmmmmmm maybe you're onto something Dannii???[/quote]


Subprime mortgages are a total mess....Hayek warned the world of malinvestments. You are right about Barney Frank. Total scumbag. Fannie Mae was involved in an accounting scandal. They inflated their income. Hopefully the SEC made the responsible parties accountable....Goldman Sachs corrupt. Goldman Sachs is currently being sued for $1.07 billion for fraud, breach of contract, and negligence.

KMA, that sounds just like the Vinnie we know!

Sorry to be crude but this sums up Barney Frank!!!

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All hot air!!!!

shramiac wrote:Sorry to be crude but this sums up Barney Frank!!!

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All hot air!!!!

He's a post Keynesian. Barney Frank knows nothing of dealing with the debt. His idea of job creation is expanding bureaucracy, which creates nothing. Globalism is causing the high rate of unemployment. The jobs in the United States are exported to India and China. The one subject that I disagree with Milton Friedman on is Free Trade. The employment and economy of the United States relies upon tarriffs. Such taxes would increase the price of imports, raising the price. The United States has become a giant shopping mall. Our economy is dependent on consumerism. However, the consumerist economy is a failure because you must first produce something, then sell it to have and economy. Frank needs to read Irwin Schiff's "How an economy Grows and why it doesn't".

poserboy71 wrote:Well since watching the "Some Kind Of Monster" DVD, I can see that James no longer needs to impose himself on others. He almost lost EVERYTHING because of this need. It hit home when I believe his wife threatened to leave. Seriously, Who goes on a hunting trip on your child's birthday ???
James actually gained more control by giving up some control to the other members.

I will say that James is an INTJ simply because HE is Metallica's musical director. Without him, NO METALLICA.

You will notice that it's USUALLY the least talented that have the biggest mouths.( Lars and myself) I wouldn't tolerate anyone yelling in my face like Lars did to James,yet, James took it like he felt he deserved it.

Yep. James had an alcohol problem. That is a strain on everyone's life.

Good observation about Lars Ulrich and James Hetfield. At first, James was unwilling to put up with that. Then as his friendship with Lars became strong his tertiary function (Fi), or introverted feelings kicked in and he started seeking harmony. My sibling did that to me on the phone once, and I was trying to work things out. *Face palm*

Anyway, these are the cognitive functions for INTJs (off the Wikipedia)

Dominant: Introverted intuition (Ni)
Attracted to symbolic actions or devices, Ni synthesizes seeming paradoxes to create the previously unimagined. These realizations come with a certainty that demands action to fulfill a new vision of the future, solutions that may include complex systems or universal truths. [18]
Auxiliary: Extraverted thinking (Te)
Te organizes and schedules ideas and the environment to ensure the efficient, productive pursuit of objectives. Te seeks logical explanations for actions, events, and conclusions, looking for faulty reasoning and lapses in sequence. [19]
Tertiary: Introverted feeling (Fi)
Fi filters information based on interpretations of worth, forming judgments according to criteria that are often intangible. Fi constantly balances an internal set of values such as harmony and authenticity. Attuned to subtle distinctions, Fi innately senses what is true and what is false in a situation. [20]
Inferior: Extraverted sensing (Se)
Se focuses on the experiences and sensations of the immediate, physical world. With an acute awareness of the present surroundings, it brings relevant facts and details to the forefront and may lead to spontaneous action. [21]