http://www.bravewords.com/braveboard/vi ... 1&t=140059
http://www.kissfaq.com/forum11/viewtopi ... =1&t=86765

According to a fan at the Indy KISS expo - from Gene Simmons -

"Yes, he told more in depth stories about Vinnie. 14 lawsuits and currently Vinnie is planning a 15th lawsuit. He also said Vinnie sued his own lawyer, and won!!!"

http://www.allposters.com/-sp/KISS-Paul ... 13797_.htm

Sorry if already posted - didn't see it anywhere so - delete if already posted -

One thing is certain. Vinnie will never stop trying to sue kiss. And the other certainty is vv will never win. He will have more chance in suing his own lawyers which maybe the point.

This just in, Vinnie sues himself. And wins!

AshesToAshes wrote:This just in, Vinnie sues himself. And wins!

Don't give him any ideas...

I love it when he threatens to sue. He acts like he is the judge abd jury and its a foregone conclusion. Note to anyone he tries to sue get him to take a mental health test.

Gene speaks of Vinnie 53:00 mark
www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsWf68xklJQ
Vinnie working on 15th lawsuit
fired Vinnie 3 times
fired Ace 3 times

strangeways wrote:Gene speaks of Vinnie 53:00 mark

Vinnie working on 15th lawsuit
fired Vinnie 3 times
fired Ace 3 times

Wow he talked about Vinnie more than i thought !

Yeah. Wow.

After 15th loss look for 16th.
Nice gene said vv had great talent.

Ace LEFT KIss-he wasn't fired.............so much for honesty,after all those years

Sad how he still needs to tell his version-about everything.

Exactly Ankh...Gene is the biggest douche Loves to tell twisted stories and lies.

Yeah I dont think its totally accurate
. I thought he was actually very nice about vv in this and disnt mention any issue other than he wouldn't sign.
As for ace gene should be nicer. Ace had by far the best solo album and one day they will need him for a desperate reunion tour. Ace gave kiss an edge they would never of had with anyone else. Vv maybe too.

Peter was called back for the symphony since the promoters demandced threequarters of original lineup.

And probably the whole issue was simply about money-how much he asked and how much they offered to him.

About Vinnie,i would like to point out something:after years of working in the music biz,he had enough experience and probably good reasons-from his point of view- not to sign that contract.And how can you fire soembody you didn't have under contract,btw?

After so many years do they still need to thump their chest and not be objective about such issues?And they STILL are tryng to be revisionists about their past and the involvement of the people-from band members to management and the whole staff- to the point of almost believing their own hype.Again
It sounds petty and pretty senile....................

Rush,for example, don't seem to be so in need to rewrite their history and never-it seems- had lost the respect of their fans just by telling how things were.

Yeah .
I guess because he sues yearly he is always on genes mind. The thing about his ex wife was low.. he was trying to insinuate vv had something to do with it ? What was the point?
Man if vv had signed what would have happened? If they didnt like him and ethics were bad why did they still want him to sign? I actually just think they thought he would be cheap but it didnt turn out so simple.

So is gene saying all lick it up tour and creatures was uninsured? He says insurance company wouldn't insure if vv wasnt signed to band? .I think its a quick easy answer as I am certain it wasnt just the insurance.

doublev2 wrote:So is gene saying all lick it up tour and creatures was uninsured? He says insurance company wouldn't insure if vv wasnt signed to band? .I think its a quick easy answer as I am certain it wasnt just the insurance.

I agree. There would be no way in hell that the tour was uninsured!

doublev2 wrote:Yeah .
I guess because he sues yearly he is always on genes mind. The thing about his ex wife was low.. he was trying to insinuate vv had something to do with it ? What was the point?
.

I took it as Gene pointing out that Vinnie didn't pay child support and blew all his money on suing Kiss and his own lawyers so she had to become a prostitute? Still kinda low of Gene to say if he doesn't know all the details.

When Gene kept saying "public record" , I was squirming.

Horrible lack of taste mentioning that tragedy. There was no reason to.

There's a story in Peter Criss' book detailing the reason why Gene had bad breath on one occasion! Sums up Gene's lack of taste!!!!

about insurance,that was a very sore point when they had to deal with Eric 's illness, so i doubt it was the main reason of the rift between Vinnie and the band.

But only people involved know the truth and even their perspective may be a bit biased.

In any case,i find hard to understand the lows people reach just to satisfy their pettyness.Esopecially when they are reaching third age.

Gene and vinnie sre one and the same in a lot of ways.

Whatever happened about alimony its mon of genes business to demonize vinnie for that. Sometimes having no money is a crime in the eyes of wealthhy people.

Haha. How many times have I heard that. Vinnnie has no case against kiss and you know it.
These angel are poisoning vinnie even more. He needs reality not crazy talk. They all know what they are doing which is what makes it so ridiculous.

Fare share of what? Royalties are paid by label not gene. Vv sues for not getting paid enough on tour in 1983 and 84.

Oh and he says but couldnt prove his signature was forged for revenge work which he decided he should have been paid more for than agreed.

Not only can not prove anything but he went on record in 1987 1988 1994 1995 and 1996 that he loves paul and gene and is always there for them. Doesnt make sense if they had forged his signiture and screwed him over as he now declares.

PinkWiz wrote:

AshesToAshes wrote:This just in, Vinnie sues himself. And wins!

Don't give him any ideas...

The fact is Gene and Paul are businessmen and its their band. If Vinnie would have signed that contract, he could possibly be a multimillionaire today.

He's certainly be better off, and may not have had to declare bankruptcy so many times.

i've always said this about gene and paul.................

they wanted to be the only ones post ace and peter in kiss with any kind of ego.

ego equals showmanship and something for the fans to be involved in with the band.


i dont understand how gene sees ace in a better light than vinnie at this point when ace showed up at his house in a nazi uniform and has done countless other things involving jewish people to gene. i'd welcome vinnie back before ace and thats saying something.

i wish that the 96 reunion was gene paul vinnie and eric.

metatron wrote:You do realize that KISS has the Nazi SS in it's logo & Gene & Paul don't mind that as long as it's making them money . In someways I think the bottom line with Gene & Paul is $$, more than anything else. Maybe Gene & Paul replace the two Nazi SS with $$ when they look at the KISS logo.

nazi germany stole alot....i really doubt they came up with the design just like the swastika wasnt theirs

AceAlive1 wrote:

metatron wrote:You do realize that KISS has the Nazi SS in it's logo & Gene & Paul don't mind that as long as it's making them money . In someways I think the bottom line with Gene & Paul is $$, more than anything else. Maybe Gene & Paul replace the two Nazi SS with $$ when they look at the KISS logo.

nazi germany stole alot....i really doubt they came up with the design just like the swastika wasnt theirs

Why would Gene & Paul use the Nazi styled SS if they were so offended by the NAZIs. Even if the Nazis didn't originally design them, it was pretty blatant what they represented. To most people, you put those lighting blot SS up on their own & the first thing they will say is... The Nazi... 3rd Reich.

In a way, I can appreciate that they took something known as a symbol associated with evil (in large part against their own people)and gave it more of a positive value.

It's like they took ownership of it IN A WEIRD WAY.

Hey, don't get me wrong...When you see that Logo you know it's KISS.
And I wouldn't want it any other way.
But the fact remains.
Just look at the German KISS pressings.
It is, what it is.

Kiss was represented that way in Germany because the country doesn't like anything to do with the Nazi way. Everything for Germany' the stage logo, the pinball machine, has the modified logo.

I think they used the lightning bolts cause they look cool, not as a nod to Nazi German history.

Ace collected Nazi memorabilia and I figured he stuck the lighting bolts on the logo to see if he could get one over on the "two Jews". It'd be like Ace's sense of humor to do that.

Man I didnt know that... really? The kiss logo was offensive in germany?

I think the german logo looks more military than the original. I always thought it was a trademark issue.

I like german logo.. it doesnt match well which I like.

I would love someone german explain it to me. Is it offensive if you dont mind me asking?

Genebaby wrote:
I think they used the lightning bolts cause they look cool, not as a nod to Nazi German history.

I believe this as well.

However, They had the power to change things when the resemblance came to light and they didn't.

Ace has always flat out denied that he was thinkiong about the nazis when he invented the logo,even touhg he's fascinated with the nazi fashion and style,and a couple other things( it seems also that,being of a german descent, his uncle was a soldier in german army),nothing so uncommon for some rockers of the 70's.Yet in the "hellbox" book, Sean stated that Ace used that style on purpose and gene realized that the controversy would have helped the group rise to fame.

In germany things related to that part of their past is banned,down to the part of the national hymn where it states "Deuscthland uber alles".Paul sang that part wihtout knowing it wasn't allowed to, and the crowd wasn't so pleased.Gene asked if Ace wanted to say soemthing to the german crowd and he did sing the banned verse again.

The generations born in late 50's and early 60's were raised with a shame about the german recent past are still very much ashamed about what did happen and even some people who were soldiers at the time of the war were shocked since they didn't knew what was happening in the camps.It is a touchy subject for every german ,i think but i think our wolfgang can explain that much better than me.

The whole world war II has so many grey areas that ,even to talk about it is like walking on glass. The more toimes passeds by ,more real facts come to the surface,and there's always good source to be ashamed on all counts.

In my country not many people knew or know about the fact that italy did create concentration camps for enemies or the horrible things that both italians and the former dux did as person.Not even his supporters.On the other side,what was made public of the communist era in URSS was a source for embarrasssment and shame for left wing parties who ,in good faith didn't know squat about the horrible things happening there too.

The only thing i would like to add is that,even if they've been guilty, typecast one nation or another for what did happen is a mistake since A)doesn't make you realize that, if the circumstances are leading to such things, those atrocities could happen everywhere- it is related to human nature,not just one particilar nation-and be make you become blind when such seeds of insanity begin to blossom somewhere else.

Sorry for the rant

back to Vinnie,if he decides to sue kiss again,i hope this time he has the right kind of evidence

Yes exactky. Also we are told history in form of propaganda so who knows what was going on.

doublev2 wrote:Yes exactky. Also we are told history in form of propaganda so who knows what was going on.

[youtube][/youtube]
History is written by the winners.

Genebaby wrote:Kiss was represented that way in Germany because the country doesn't like anything to do with the Nazi way. Everything for Germany' the stage logo, the pinball machine, has the modified logo.

I think they used the lightning bolts cause they look cool, not as a nod to Nazi German history.

I've seen KISS in Germany five times, the logo in stage was original! Only records come with the "German" logo. you also can buy original logo t shirts without any problems

doublev2 wrote:I would love someone german explain it to me. Is it offensive if you dont mind me asking?

I am German. just ask me

Maybe we should open a new tread for that...

Cool.

Cool Stef. I've seen pics of the Kiss stage with altered logos. Would have been the 80's.