WASP

doublev2 · Post by **doublev2** » Mon Jul 23, 2012 7:29 pm

always liked this. was it ever a studio release? i thought it was on the second album but i dont see it listed anymore [youtube][/youtube]

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 4:04 am

WASP is one band I readily admit that I do not like. Over the years several friends tried to sell me on them, but I just don't think their songs had strong enough hooks. I also never thought their look & act were well enough defined.

doublev2 · Post by **doublev2** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 6:37 am

I thought the mean man tour was extremely good. I think they were so good live, I kind of understand where you are coming from with the songs erg2

PinkWiz · Post by **PinkWiz** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:29 am

I love WASP but Blackie kinda seems like a douche nowadays. This tune was recorded for Live in the Raw. Manimal was on there too.

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:36 am

I dig Blackie's voice and you can tell by listening that they can/could play. They just couldn't nail down a hook to save themselves. I'm not saying that EVERY song on EVERY album has to be crowd-friendly chant-along. But if you are in the metal game, you have to have a few songs with choruses that crowd can sing along too...and, more importantly, casual fans can become familiar with quickly. When that happens, people will get into you and check out your more "artistic" songs.
The closest WASP ever came was their cover of THE REAL ME, which I thought was pretty fantastic. But that didn't come along until the genre was starting to slide. And it was a cover that (probably) most 13-16 years olds were not super familiar with!

PinkWiz · Post by **PinkWiz** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:25 am

Hmmm, I kinda always thought LOVE Machine, Wild Child, I Wanna Be Somebody, Restless Gypsy and a couple others had great hooks... or dare I say, were very "sing-along-ish?"

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:12 pm

PinkWiz wrote:Hmmm, I kinda always thought LOVE Machine, Wild Child, I Wanna Be Somebody, Restless Gypsy and a couple others had great hooks... or dare I say, were very "sing-along-ish?"

I agree

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:10 pm

PinkWiz wrote:Hmmm, I kinda always thought LOVE Machine, Wild Child, I Wanna Be Somebody, Restless Gypsy and a couple others had great hooks... or dare I say, were very "sing-along-ish?"

It is just my opinion. I am very familiar with these songs and I think they are close, but they just don't roll off the tongue. The lyrics don't land right on the beat.
I also look at it this way: these guys were around for almost the entire metal wave, they had label support, they had promotion and the message of rebellion was there...and yet they never broke out to the A level. Lots of less talented bands with much less talented singers sold a lot more on the back of songs with catchy, easily digestible, sing-along hooks.

poserboy71 · Post by **poserboy71** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:31 pm

erg2, You are correct as well

Post by **Genebaby** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:01 pm

LO VE, all I needs my love machine!!!

Do you like the song Headless Children? I think it's very good.

The Crimson Idol was a great album. The last one I really liked was KFD. Cool album.

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:55 pm

I don't think I've ever listened to the Crimson Idol album. At least not more than once and certainly not with close attention to judge it.

Post by **Genebaby** » Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:49 pm

Man, it spent a lot of time in my Walkman twenty years ago. Bob Kulick played guitar on it. I like the drums too.

doublev2 · Post by **doublev2** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:05 am

One of Bob Kulicks best moments along with Paul's solo album.

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:28 am

I read an interview with Bob. His memory of recording that album and Blackie's personality is not super-complimentary.

Crimson Idol wasn't released until the early 90's. By that point I was almost out of college, most of my friends weren't listening to metal anymore, most of the ones who didn't listen to WASP and I wasn't going to be spending what little bit of money I had on a band I didn't care that much for in High School. Like I said, I know that someone played it for me at some point around when it came out...but I wasn't really paying attention.

doublev2 · Post by **doublev2** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:45 am

It was odd because most people thought no Chris Holmes = no wasp. I remember an interview with bob just before it came out. I believe bobby.rock with his kulick connection.was supposed to drum on it but last minute it didn't work out.

PinkWiz · Post by **PinkWiz** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:57 am

I never really dug WASP as much after Blackie got all serious and shunned his past. I liked him when he was still fucking like a beast...

doublev2 · Post by **doublev2** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:59 am

i still say they were much better than anyone LIVE apart from Alice Cooper and that for me includes Kiss, Ratt and Motley Crue. The shows that I saw could not be beat, but studio not as good in my opinion.

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:12 pm

For me it was kind of disappointing and frustrating. Like I said, I thought Blackie had a great voice and the message of rebellion was there. I just don't hear a good anthem with a strong hook in their library. Some decent songs, playing and singing. A couple of cool songs with cool ideas. Just not that song with the big memorable hook that would make the casual rock fan stop and take notice to give the rest of the album a listen.

KISS = Rock and Roll All Night
Motley = Shout At The Devil
AC/DC = almost every fucking song in their catalog!
Alice = School's Out
Marilyn Manson = The Beautiful People
Quiet Riot = Bang Your Head

All of these bands have cool songs that don't have the big, catchy sing-along hook. But they knew they had to make the anthem. WASP has some good songs...but from what I've heard they've never made that one magic-ingredient song that makes even your 8 year old sibling sing the chorus just from hearing you play it in your bedroom.

PinkWiz · Post by **PinkWiz** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:12 pm

I gotta say that I think I Wanna Be Somebody is just as much an anthem as Shout At The Devil, School's Out, etc. The title alone states it's an anthem and the chorus is catchy as hell?

Or we could go with "bye bye bye Ballcrusher?"

[youtube][/youtube]

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:43 pm

I agree that it's what they were shooting for but I don't think it is fully successful. The drums don't nail the accent points, the bass feels a little weak and the chorus is big and echoey...but it isn't as full as it should be.

Id give it a B- or a B maybe if I'm really in a headbangin' mood. It's good, but it's not quite there.

Again, this is only MY opinion, but keep in mind the song wasn't a hit by any stretch. Lack of promotion? No. It was pushed. Or lack of that intangible mixture of elements that makes a song go from good to anthem.

PinkWiz · Post by **PinkWiz** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:07 pm

Yes if you're talking hits then no, Wasp didn't have any. I think mostly because their image was a little darker and not as mainstream as say, Twisted Sister, Crue, etc. Blackie originally wrote Wild Child for the Crue but Nikki didn't think Vince would be able to pull off the vocal. As big as the Crue was in '85, imo Wild Child could've been an anthem/hit for them if they would've accepted Blackie's offer.

ankh · Post by **ankh** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:21 pm

liked some songs but they were never so appealing to me, soemthing was lacking.I think also that the first marketing plan created so much hype yet the first record didn't live up to their reputation.I think the image was too cartoonishand they needed better songs.The fact that- even for Gene's standadrs- Blackie begun to behave like he was the best thing since sliced bread didn't help either.I did like their cover of "the real me" by the Who.

One funny trivia: i've seen them live in '86, opening for Iron Maiden.Thye were good but not great .Blackie was wearing a sort of black see through leotard,and while he was going through one of his " I got this woman and she was impressed by size and blah blah blah" raps, one guy next to me pointed out at his weiner and said to his friends "look !He has such a small dick!".

erg2 · Post by **erg2** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:58 am

ankh wrote:liked some songs but they were never so appealing to me, soemthing was lacking.

Exactly. It's hard to put my finger on one exact thing. I call it the "intangible". The only thing they ever did that made me stop and take notice as being anything above average was the same as Ankh; THE REAL ME by THE WHO.

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